Discussion Episode 23: LARP Follow-up Part 1
The madness of August has passed, so we’ve finally gotten the chance to edit and put up our follow-up discussion about Jen’s LARP experience. Kevin and Jen are joined by Clyde Rhoer of Theory from the Closet and Jim Ryan from The Great Debate to discuss some of the finer points of our previous episode. Clyde brings his experience running a large troupe (Non-Camarilla) game Back In The Day and Jim is a current Venue Storyteller in Charlotte, North Carolina. We discuss the Cam’s similarities to cults, as well as a few other behaviors and quirks of this particular brand of LARP.
Relevant Links
- The Great Debate
- Theory from the Closet
- The Camarilla
- White Wolf
- One World By Night
- Basic Story Structure
- Campbell
- Soap Operas
- Story Before, Now, & After
- Gamer: The Podcasting
Crunchy Bits!
- Intro and Outro music by
Podcast: |
Tags: Campbell, Gamer: The Podcasting, Jen, Kevin, One World By Night, Soap Operas, Story After, Story Before, Story Now, The Camarilla, The Great Debate, The Universal Greeting, Theory from the Closet, White Wolf
There are quite a few individuals in the Camarilla that are failures at life. They are largely “bottom of the barrel” people that live in their parent’s house (even though they are in their 30’s), live in lower-class housing, or cluster together as semi-squatters in communal homes, and “the game” is their primary social outlet. They involve themselves so thoroughly in their character’s existences to detriment of their own lives, because it is far easier to have your character be awesome than it is to strive to achieve things in real life. Thus, when you downplay their character’s achievements, or reveal the truth to them, you cause them to become angry at themselves for being absolute failures at life, and instead of using such emotions to better themselves, they take the easier route and focus on the person speaking the truth.
Sadly, as the organization has no “Quality Control”, and anyone can join, you often get the “undesirable element”, those individuals whom have forgotten basic hygiene, and would rather live in the world of make believe. Unfortunately, it is those same individuals whom rise to the top of the organization, often being elected on popularity vote, like a turd rising to the top. Once those proverbial turds float upwards, they defend their position with such vehemence and lash out furiously at anyone whom would nay-say them with what little power they have. Such power is limited in scope to suspension from activities with the club, and detrimental effects to your character.
Those people whom actually accomplish things in life often are fringe elements and “general members” of the Camarilla, as they don’t have as much time to devote to the activity as those “undesirables” whom are unemployed or willing to spend all their free time involved in the organization. When they make a proposal, or do something that is controversial that the officers dislike, such as working against the character of an “undesirable” whom is in charge or has friends in charge, they often find themselves punished. After a few instances of such, all but the most stubborn leave to do something more fulfilling and less aggravating with their time and efforts. This has a profound negative effect, as it leaves the shittier element still in place, and chases off those people whom actually win at life.
Thus, the game is rigged to encourage the turds to float to the top, and maintains them as the core of the Camarilla, by giving them powers to punish those they don’t like. It’s a sad, corrupt little system without any real system of checks-and-balances, even though there is a (laughable) Appeal system.
As for the sex situation, think about it this way; these are all individuals whom are socially awkward and inept, when they receive positive attention, even from some of the most unattractive individuals in the organization, their little hearts flutter. Hence, many of them have little to no standards, and some of the most unsightly individuals often pair off to grind their nasties together. This is also an attraction to repulsive females to join, as they are almost guaranteed they can find someone desperate enough to overlook their horrid appearance. Thus, another factor which exponentially causes the organization to appear to be full of fail.
I’m so glad that the military personnel, lawyers, doctors, police officers, EMTs, and other professionals are being told we have no hygiene because we are in the Camarilla. This is a gaming organization. Yes you will have those few who are exemplary members of everything you’ve stated here. But then you have the majority, who are professional, clean, productive members of society who have joined because they would like to play the games offered.
As for appearances, there are some absolutely beautiful people in the Camarilla. In fact, I can think of no less than three models who belong to the Camarilla.
And since the subject of sex got brought up, why are you talking about how pathetic and ugly we are, unless you’re not even lucky enough to get that once-every-so-often yourself?
Maybe if you came to a game, you could be shown the errors of your ways, but to be completely honest, with how negative you have been, I wouldn’t want you here. So see? Not EVERYBODY can join.
The trolls.
Please don’t feed them.
Little butthurt there David?
Ignore the haters
Love the show!
Great podcast guys. I found the first LaRP podcast extremely interesting. Though more than ten years ago, my own experiences were fairly similar to Jen’s. My wife, on the other hand, played with a group for whom it was just a game, and she had a lot of fun. It really does depend on who you game with.
This follow-up ‘cast was great, and I look forward to Part 2.
Thanks!
I have very mixed feelings about this and the previous Camarilla podcast, but one thing I am sure of they are excellent listening! Rich with content and stuff that gets me all fired up. I’m engaged and that’s a success to all of you.
Here is where my mixed feelings come in. I do think that the Camarilla has some issues, particularly around gameplay. I’m not so concerned about the social stuff. However, I feel that Jenn’s ego is starting to get in the way of that dialogue. Kevin, you do an excellent job of keeping that in check, but sometimes I feel that for you, Jenn, this is all about the attention you are getting and I think that harms some of your critical objectivity. You have a lively and intelligent personality and your voice brings a lot to the show, but at times I feel a very powerful narcissism that really makes it difficult for me to continue listening. I apologize if that is too critical and personal, but I do think that it is something that lessens your effectiveness as a host, a skill at which you otherwise have great potential.
The show should be about the subject, not the hosts. The hosts personality should be a light spicing to keep the flavour good, but it should not dominate the meal.
Hi Jen,
I found these LARP podcasts interesting to listen to. I Pity you for having such bad experiences and admire you for sticking with them for NINE MONTHS! Your tone is very negative throughout the first podcast, but considering the circumstances and above all the great span of time, I am all but surprised.
I’ve been larping for a while now (about 10 years) and none of which you describe is anywhere near the hobby I enjoy. (though partly because we do have a different format here) It is however exactly why I steer away from some of the larps and groups I know of, simply because I know their play style is not compatible with me.
I d invite you to check out some of the events I enjoy but doubt you d be willing to travel to Belgium to do so. I do hope these experiences have not spoiled the hobby for you though having listened to the podcast, I would understand if you d never want anything to do with it ever again.
Im looking forward to the next part of these larp podcasts..
From your Wikipedia link to Soap Operas.
The main characteristics that define soap operas are “an emphasis on family life, personal relationships, sexual dramas, emotional and moral conflicts; some coverage of topical issues; set in familiar domestic interiors with only occasional excursions into new locations”.
Fuck yeah. That’s a good part of what I meant. Add that traditionally they don’t seem to be as concerned with long term plot, as much as, what works now, and a dedicated love of the Retcon / Rewrite, and we’re totally there.
I enjoy reading the comments here and am both bolstered and exhausted by the responses. Fist off, to all those whining that “good people larp too” and “we’re not all unwashed idiots” I say this: you’re right. No organization is all one type of person or another. What I can say is my experiences and those of others seem to reflect a higher percentage in the Cam than other groups. I’d love to do a scientific study on the issue. Any of you Cam members want to spearhead a widespread survey? But to be honest what unwashed loser is going to admit that they are either openly? Most would rather express outrage against a stated truth than take a shower.
I find it interesting how defensive some of you get on these topics. Waste time burning me at your mobs or spend time fixing the problems. I don’t just talk about hygiene or damage. Where are your responses to the game related problems or social ramifications of a Cam lifestyle?
I understand many geeks link their sense of self to their particular choice of hobby, be it larping, wow, or whatever. I think the first step here is to value yourself outside of your hobbies, know yourself and spend time living your life. Only then, separate from your time wasters can you really start to see the true values or damages that your actions have upon your life.
Stop hiding behind your hobbies. Be more than just a geek, a gamer or a LARPer. Enjoy your hobbies, express yourself and open your eyes to how those things are molding you as a person.
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